The Daily Bell
produced this interview with an interesting man who apparently has had
great success marching to his own drumbeat. Hardly conventional in
lifestyle or life-path, Fitzroy McLean is an entertaining interview and
offers many opinions on various investing opportunities.
Fitzroy McLean on Freedom, International Investing and How to Improve ‘the Space Between One’s Ears’
Fitzroy Mclean
The Daily Bell is pleased to present an exclusive interview with Fitzroy McLean: (left).
Introduction: Fitzroy McLean is a West Point
graduate and former Army Ranger and Special Operations Officer who
served throughout Europe, Africa, and the Middle East – until he was
struck with an epiphany: he didn’t believe in government at all, at
least not the intrusive form of government that is commonplace
throughout the western world. Fitz went on to earn a graduate degree
from Oxford, then headed off for the emerging markets of Africa, Eastern
Europe, South America, and the Middle East, first as an entrepreneur
and later as a fund manager. His emerging-market fund earned over 30%
annually before being absorbed by one of the world’s largest sovereign
wealth funds. Fitz, proud of his political incorrectness, is a
self-described Libertarian with anarchist and hedonist tendencies. He’s
not an angry expat, “America Basher,” or any kind of basher at all. He
still loves the idea of America, if not its government, and firmly
believes in the ideas advanced by the US founding fathers. While
scouring the globe for profitable investments, he is always in search of
a small, isolated place where he can found Fitzmcleanastan. Without
Borders readers will be first to know when passports are available.
Daily Bell: Thank you for taking time to be with us today.
Fitzroy McLean: It is my pleasure. I always enjoy the Daily Bell for its unique insight and analysis.
Daily Bell: What is Without Borders? A newsletter? A web site? An approach to life?
Fitzroy McLean: It is definitely not a website. I’m a
complete techno Luddite and more than a few people tease me about how
underutilized pr sub optimal
is. Without Borders is an ethos and idea that centers on freedom and
self-reliance. Without Borders, the publication, is a newsletter that is
little more than a running account of my travels and what our roving
band of intrepid capitalists are doing with our time and money. As a
going concern, Without Borders is a mediocre enterprise but as a
community of like-minded freedom seeking individuals it has been a
tremendous success. We have subscribers in twenty-three countries and
the one unifying characteristic amongst them all is the desire to live
an extraordinary life unbound by convention or the artificial
constraints of geography. Our group includes retirees with multi
million dollar self managed investment portfolios as well as members of
the “have laptop will travel” crowd who work their way around the globe
as consultants or free lance programmers, writers or any number of
trades. Everyone is welcome. The fact that our portfolio has returned
more than 40% annually since inception is a by-product of our outlook on
life and the world in general and the markets in particular. We are a
select but growing group of people and I enjoy meeting with them and
sharing ideas whenever our paths cross.
Daily Bell: Give us some background. Where did you grow up?
Fitzroy McLean: I grew up in New England. Both my
parents were Ivy League educators with a very traditional elitist East
Coast view of the world. They were of the generation and class that
thought that success was defined by your formal education and your job
security – hence an Ivy League education and tenure was the height of
conforming to the ideal. I come form a long line of socialists. They
would call themselves ¨liberals¨ but when you scratch the surface you
get collectivists and socialists of varying degrees. As a Libertarian
(although I didn’t know the term then) I was always the intellectual
black sheep. I must be one of the only people to have gone to West Point
as an act of societal rebellion. I didn’t even tell them I applied. My
entire family thought I was going to Dartmouth in the fall. I applied
to West Point in secret – even going through the Congressional
appointment process without telling anyone and forging my parents’
signature on the application forms. Then six days after High School
graduation, I sent them a post card from West Point after I had already
been sworn in.
Daily Bell: Tell us about your army experience?
Fitzroy McLean: Although I was on academic probation
or conduct probation or both for seven of the eight semesters at West
Point, I loved the Army. I didn’t do well with the “leadership by shiny
shoes” crowd but I loved the leadership challenges and physical
challenges. I spent most of my career deployed outside of the US. I had a
variety of positions in Airborne and Ranger Units as well as other
Special Operations positions, which were as close to being a pro athlete
as anyone with my genetics could manage. I also served as an Aide de
Camp to a commanding general of US forces in Europe, which was a
spectacular experience for two reasons. First my boss was one of the
most brilliant and honorable men imaginable and he taught me a
tremendous amount. He taught me to question everything but to do it in a
respectful and thoughtful manner. Secondly, I learned that after
Captain an Army Officer’s life is spent wearing plastic shoes and
polyester pants for at least ten years until you are eligible to do the
fun stuff again. As a result I can say I loved every day I spent in
uniform but one more day would have been one day too many.
Daily Bell: You were a paratrooper? What was that like? What did you learn?
Fitzroy McLean: The Army is a great way for a young
person to learn about themselves and human nature. Despite what many
people think, the armed forces are a microcosm of society. You have all
races and socio economic backgrounds. There are a proportionate number
of MENSA members as there are high school dropouts. You have WASPY Yale
graduates serving next to inner city black kids who grew up on the
streets and had to struggle to pass the GED. What you learn most in the
army is that there are no points for your background in combat. All
that matters is how you handle today. Are you a stand up guy? Will you
do what you say you will do? There are plenty of solar powered heroes
who fall apart after two days without sleep and cold rain running down
the crack of their ass. More than anything else, the army taught me to
value people for their abilities and attitude rather than their
background or their formal qualifications. Subsequently that same
lesson helped me understand that individual traits transcend
nationality and culture. In fact nationality is as arbitrary as skin
color, hair color or eye color. It is completely irrelevant.
Daily Bell: When did you leave the army and why?
Fitzroy McLean: Because I was recruited into the
paramilitary division of the Ciaos clandestine service. It seemed like a
lot of fun. It was a lot of fun. What young man with an excess of
testosterone wouldn’t want to run around the globe in alias breaking
laws with the sanction of his government. It wasn’t until much later I
started to question the morality and nobility of the work. As a product
of the Cold War era, I believed I was a freedom fighter. My life’s
mission was to liberate the oppressed. It actually said so in Latin on
my unit crest. Images of young boys being shot as they tried to cross
“neimandsland” in Berlin motivated me. My righteousness was unwavering
because I believed my government stood for the individual above the
collective. We were fighting to bring down governments that restricted
the freedoms of their people. It only started to dawn on me later that
those days were over. Somewhere along the line we gave up the idea of
freedom in lieu of democracy and democracy is mob rule by the easily
persuaded. After the Berlin Wall fell, America stepped up its long march
towards being just another nation state. America was an idea and
sadly I feel that America is no more. Now there is just The United
States which is sadly just another government monstrosity plodding
towards irrelevance. History shows that the death rattle of a nation
state can be very painful for the citizenry. It pains me that there is
no place left for those who truly want to be free.
Daily Bell: What did you do during your further career before starting your current venture?
Fitzroy McLean: If we are being accurate and honest
then the answer is I failed often and quickly at several ventures and
then I succeeded at a couple of others. It was one home run logistics
business in Africa that changed my financial life dramatically. I sold a
business to a public company and put enough in the bank to serve as a
comfortable grubstake for anything I wanted to do in the future. I also
went to graduate school at Oxford and although I didn’t learn much of
practical use it did open some doors and put me in touch with some
great people whom I still work with on a regular basis. An MBA taught
me that formal business education was a total waste of time and was
designed to perpetuate conventional mediocrity. It also heightened my
distain for conventional wisdom. I was fortunate to go there once I was
already financially independent so I could pick fights with the
faculty. However, Oxford was helpful because their system is designed
to force students to teach themselves as opposed to the US method,
which is more to be taught and then regurgitate what someone else
thinks. I am much better for the experience because of the rolodex and
the attitude if not the subject matter expertise.
Daily Bell: How did you get interested in investing?
Fitzroy McLean: After my time as an entrepreneur, a
banker friend convinced me to go into Private Equity. He was forming a
private equity fund focused on emerging markets and although he and the
others were brilliant financial minds they hadn’t spent that much time
in places without five star hotels. I joined the team as the
operational and political risk expert but soon learned the financial
part of the business. What we all learned is that conventional
financial wisdom is almost always wrong. When we started the fund it
was just after the Asian crisis and Mexico’s bailout. Everyone thought
we were nuts. We had to guarantee investors money with our vital organs
to get them to invest. When we sold out, Goldman Sacs and the Carlyle
Group were paying over the odds for opaque state run banks in China. We
invested in and helped grow some great companies but our success was
at least 50% timing the opinion cycle and riding that wave.
Daily Bell: Why do you believe that international investing is a great opportunity?
Fitzroy McLean: I am geographically agnostic. At the
moment the best investment opportunities are outside of the US and
Western Europe because those countries are fiscally and demographically
doomed. I like to place capital in parts of the world where the cost of
capital is high because we buy more for less. We focus on companies
that operate in parts of the world where the demographics and
regulations are favorable and where we can buy things cheaply. At the
moment not much is cheap anywhere but you can still find bargains. As
we tell our readers, patience is a crucial part of investing and
speculating. Sometimes the best thing to do is nothing. Our preferred
public market investments are companies working in the developing world
that are listed on a transparent and liquid exchange. There are lots
of great little companies operating in weird and wonderful parts of the
world that are listed in New York, Toronto, London and Hong Kong. You
can buy them from the comfort of your couch and get exposure to places
most people would never venture for themselves. For instance last
summer we recommended a company called Perseus Mining that is listed in
Toronto but operates in West Africa. The shares have doubled in less
than six months and not one mainstream analyst covers the stock even
though anyone with an online brokerage account can buy and sell the
shares. We still find lots of these types of stories in many different
sectors. You just need to look where nobody else is looking.
Daily Bell: You believe in South American investments? You live there now.
Fitzroy McLean: I live in Punta del Este Uruguay
because it offers the best quality of life for our family. I play polo
and the entire family loves horses. We live on a farm just a few minutes
away from South America’s premier beach resort. Our kids speak three
languages fluently and are working on their fourth. It is a wonderful
place to live far away from the maddening financial noise of Wall Street
or The City of London. I believe in some South American investments.
We have made a lot of money in resource companies operating in South
America. We made a lot of money betting on the Brazilian consumer but
now we are net short Brazil because it is way overpriced and the new
government will almost certainly hurt the economy and investors.
Daily Bell: What are the best investment opportunities in South America?
Fitzroy McLean: Peru is exciting. Colombia is also
attractive. If they go through with an announced plan to merge the
Colombian, Peruvian and Chilean stock exchanges that will be very
exciting. Bolivia is a nightmare as is Venezuela but someday they will
present extraordinary opportunities. We really like certain Paraguayan
two-year corporate bonds that yield 12% and are a thousand times safer
than Treasuries. By far our favorite investment is farmland in Uruguay
and Paraguay. We like these two countries because we believe that food
prices will skyrocket as the dollar and euro lose purchasing power. Many
governments will then introduce price and export controls thereby
driving prices higher. Uruguay and Paraguay both produce foodstuffs that
are several hundred times what their populace could consume and they
will be free to price their exports in whatever currency is most
favorable to the producers. We have just introduced our readers to a
company that is soon to go public which will own and operate
agricultural and cattle lands in these countries. Some are even able to
invest at the pre IPO price.
Daily Bell: Where else have you traveled?
Fitzroy McLean: Wow. Tough question. At last count I
have been to 140 some odd nations if you count Taiwan and Hong Kong as
separate countries and Kosovo and Montenegro although they were not
sovereign when I was there. The number doesn’t matter much I just like
to experience different cultures.
Daily Bell: What other countries are promising?
Fitzroy McLean: Wow an even tougher question. If you
want to pack your bags and move somewhere to make your fortune then
Burma (ok Myanmar but Myanmar Joe just sounds silly), Zimbabwe and
Angola would top my list. These three countries will produce many
billionaires over the next decades as they bounce off of an absolute
bottom. If you want a place you can invest passively from afar then
Ghana is a good place to start. Indonesia has gotten too pricey of late
but holds promise when the next correction comes. I think Brazil and
Argentina are both heading for another crisis and then will present
great opportunities. One place I am very bullish on right now is
Mongolia and I am investing in a company soon to be listed in Canada
that will be the best way for foreigners to play that story.
Daily Bell: What do you think of Russia?
Fitzroy McLean:Russia is the country in the world with the most potential and always
will be. I majored in Soviet Studies at West Point. I learned the
language and knew where every ethnic group was located and the makeup of
every motorized rifle regiment. I knew that satellites disproved the
stated wheat harvests near Kiev. I assumed that I would some day jump
behind enemy lines and link up with my sexy nuclear physicist and
concert violinist contact somewhere near Stalingrad. Together we would
stop nuclear Armageddon. Since that didn’t come to fruition I have been
seeking a way to invest there for over 20 years and I am still seeking.
Russia is a disaster and not a friend of capital.
Daily Bell: How about China?
Fitzroy McLean: I am very bullish on China and we
have a lot of exposure to China. There will be blips along the way but
it is an exciting opportunity. The problem is the Chinese capital
markets are like casinos without the cheap drinks and scantily clad
waitresses. Our preferred way to play China is through small growing
companies that list on western exchanges. If you know what you are doing
you can make a fortune buying into Chinese companies when they list on
a junior exchange before they move to the Nasdaq, NYSE or LSE. We have
done very well indeed by buying into private placements in cement
companies and other industrial companies that are not tied to exporting.
Daily Bell: Where does India fit in?
Fitzroy McLean: India is a tough place to invest but
the economy is growing rapidly. It is impossible for foreigners to
invest directly in their stock market and it is hard to get capital in
and out. The key to India is having the right partners. We own Eredene
(LSE:ERE), a company that invests in port infrastructure and logistics
companies in India. They have partnered with some of the best operators
in India and the shares are presently trading at a significant discount
to their intrinsic value.
Daily Bell: What about the EU? Is the euro going to collapse?
Fitzroy McLean: The EU is a political entity not an
economic zone. Its predecessor, the EC, was a brilliant idea because it
only dealt with the movement of people, goods and services. The EU is a
bureaucracy run by socially pleasant but economically ignorant
technocrats. The EU was doomed from day one and will soon collapse. The
Euro will not survive.
Daily Bell: What about the PIGS – what will be their fate?
Fitzroy McLean: I just returned from my PIIGS tour.
(Extra I for Italy.) I am still writing it up and will publish it in
January but the short answer is that not one of those states should even
try to fight default. They all have unsustainable economic and social
policies that are completely ingrained in the populace. On this trip I
felt I was on a demonstration and protest tour. If it is Wednesday it
must be a student riot in Italy. Unlike the social unrest of the 60s and
70s these are not peace protests or demonstrations for equal rights.
These are entitlement riots. The participants are indignant that they
may not be able to count on the largess of others to subsidize their
lifestyle. The entitlement system is so deeply ingrained in the European
psyche that many cannot contemplate a life of self-reliance. The
system is doomed to destruction and it can’t come soon enough. We are
already scouting investment opportunities for after the collapse. It
will be fun to live in a castle. Jean Claude Trichet would make an
outstanding valet.
Daily Bell: Is austerity going to lead to civil unrest and a toppling of governments?
Fitzroy McLean: Actually it may not be the case
because I think politically adroit cowards run all democratic
governments. Therefore, they will cave to popular opinion and try to
paper over their problems long before the austerity measures work. The
election cycles are too short to allow the austerity to reverse fifty
years of stupidity. What will likely happen is that there will be an
economic collapse, which will usher in new governments. The real concern
should be for what comes next. History favors a strongman to ´fix´
these problems and that almost never ends well if you value your
freedom. Did I mention I live in Uruguay? I prefer to watch my riots
from afar.
Daily Bell: Why is the West imploding? Didn’t the elites see what was going to happen?
Fitzroy McLean: Ironically, I don’t think the
so-called elites have any power at all. In democracies, the dim-witted
masses have the power and an opportunistic succession of temporary
elites use that to their benefit for a while. Thankfully, the masses
have fickle tastes and the elites keep changing. I view the west as a
sad social sloth that is plodding along in search of immediate food and
shelter. The world is now run by a passing parade of powerless
politicians who pander to the easily persuaded ignorant masses. If you
have ever watched the first episode of each season of American Idol or X
Factor, you understand who votes.
Now if by elite you mean the intelligentsia, that is a different
question. Those so-called elites in the opinion maker circles are so
heavily influenced by academic rhetoric and hypothesis held out as fact
that they have no exposure to the real world. They have lived their
entire life confusing correlation with causality that they are several
standard deviations from understanding the way the world works. Those
that think they know have been operating under a false theory with so
many Greek letters substituting volatility for risk that they haven’t
any idea how to cope. The others are just group think parrots that
perpetuate the fallacy because to do anything else would risk their
position in their social and professional society. Take a look at the
recent list of Nobel Piece Prize winners and ask yourself if you would
let any of them watch your dog for the weekend.
Daily Bell: We think we will see a new currency emerging in the wake of a global meltdown. Agree?
Fitzroy McLean: Absolutely. I’m not sure what it
will look like but eventually it will have to be tied to precious metals
or a basket of commodities. I suspect we will see a series of forcibly
enforced failed currencies before we get to that stage.
Daily Bell: We think the current monetary system is finished and that something else must inevitably take its place. Agree?
Fitzroy McLean: Absolutely. What is amazing is how
long a failed system can continue after the evidence of its failure is
intuitively obvious to the casual observer.
Daily Bell: What do you think about commodity-backed money?
Fitzroy McLean: It is the only workable solution but it will be a while.
Daily Bell: Are you a free-market person? Is that a big part of your investment criteria?
Fitzroy McLean: Freedom is at the heart of
everything I do. I am a freedom zealot. I would rather be destitute and
free than comfortable and constrained. It is quite possibly a genetic
defect. Sometimes I wish I could think otherwise. Life would be simpler
and I would not drive my friends and family crazy with my rants about
how the US government ignored thousands of years of common law and
contract law in the way they handled the Chrysler bankruptcy and why it
was a moral outrage. Freedom is sacrosanct.
However, I have long given up the idea that there are any free
markets out there today. We just have a choice between generally freeish
and completely controlled. Let me correct that. The only free market
is the black market and that is the most legitimate market in existence
today. In the very near future the only truly admirable and moral
profession will be a smuggler. There will be genuine heroes that ply
that trade moving goods and people in service of humanity, although it
will be illegal. This goes to the death rattle of the nation state,
which will almost certainly be violent and oppressive. The US and Europe
will have an underground railway and covert information highway. But
that is a topic for another day.
When it comes to investing, I decide based on the prevailing
political and market conditions and reserve the right to change my mind
when the political winds change. We coined the term Politiconomy two
years ago because governments have continually rewritten the laws of
economics or rather attempted to do so. While these attempts will always
fail eventually, it can cause severe short-term pain for those who
allocated capital based on the old rules or the ¨right way to do
things.” We must remain flexible.
Daily Bell: Is what is happening in the world today somehow planned to build a new world order?
Fitzroy McLean: Not at all. This situation is where
the laws of unintended consequences meet the laws of large numbers.
This doesn’t mean there are not people looking for a NWO but if working
for the CIA and other clandestine outfits taught me anything it is
that no group comprised of type A personalities can keep a secret. What
we have are skilled opportunists maneuvering to maximize their benefit
from a system in flux. You don’t have to believe in an organized
conspiracy to believe that there will be a collapse. My experience with
so-called elites is that they couldn’t organize anything more
difficult than a scotch and soda without the help of a professional
party planner. They could never pull the strings necessary to organize
this mess. See American Idol for a more likely cause of our woes.
Daily Bell: Is there a small
monetary elite that is maneuvering behind the scenes to create a more global governance?
Fitzroy McLean: I doubt it very much.
Daily Bell: What are the best investments? Gold? Silver?
Fitzroy McLean: Precious metals, farmland, and
select stocks and bonds for the time being are very good investments.
The best investment by far is improving the space between ones own ears.
Money spent on increasing your self-reliance and your analytical
capabilities are the best use of funds today. So many of the so-called
educated class are mere sheeple and they will not be able to cope with
what is in store for them if it gets ugly. I wonder how that sociology
degree will help when the home invasions start. I hope I am wrong but I
don’t think I am.
Daily Bell: The West turning increasingly authoritarian? Where should people go?
Fitzroy McLean: That is a personal decision based on
cultural affinity and ones own skill set. Uruguay is a very European
place where my family and I can blend in comfortably. If you went to a
restaurant where we were dining you would not be able to pick us out as
foreigners unless you heard my heavily accented Spanish. Small
countries with limited resources are the best because very few other
nations care about them. Just don’t be the guy who escaped war torn
Europe for his own tropical island paradise of Guadalcanal. If you are
an American don’t think an apartment in Paris will be much of a refuge.
Daily Bell: What books and articles have you participated in that people should read?
Fitzroy McLean: Without Borders and Global Speculations are good places to start.
Daily Bell: Any other resources you want to point out to people interested in international travel and investing?
Fitzroy McLean: There are many good places to start.
Most of what I read is long out of print. Jim Rogers’ books are great.
Doug Casey’s books are by far the best out there but they are hard to
find. You can find them on Amazon from time to time. Crisis Investing
For The Rest Of The 90s is my favorite and The International Man,
although dated, is still a classic. Rory Stewart wrote a great book
entitled The Places In Between which is great but offers no investment
insight. Simon Blacks blog The Sovereign Man is definitely worth reading
as is Peter McFarlanes’ Q Wealth Report. I love the books written by
the gentlemen merchant adventures of long ago. Sir Richard Burton and
the original Fitzroy MacLean are essential reading. The novels Tai Pan
and Noble House are instructive. I could go on for days….
Daily Bell: Any last thoughts? Anything you want to emphasize that we have not covered?
Fitzroy McLean: Not now but if I think of anything maybe we can do this again.
Daily Bell: Thank you for your time.
Fitzroy McLean: It’s been a pleasure.